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LRP vs Re-enactment by Richard Layton Expand / Collapse
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Posted Sunday, October 01, 2006 10:21 AM


Prodigal

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Someone told me a long time ago (can't remember who) that the whole ring/chain thing was srarted by Gary Gygax who wanted more grades of armour when he was writing Tunnels and Trolls or 1st edition D&D. I'm sure I've seen the phrase used in older documents though (though not that old)
Post #15398
Posted Sunday, October 01, 2006 3:36 PM
Heroic Knight

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don't particularly like that article

the author admits its not worth comparing the two as they're different thing, quotes anecdotal evidence to put down LRP in some areas but doesn't balance it with the same in living history, and adds nonsensical comments like " I am hoping it was just that person and not representative of LRP-ers as a whole." If you think thats true then why mention it. If you've seen sufficient evidence to make this worth commenting on then stand behind it.

There is some value in it comparing kit of LH/reenactors to LRPers. I agree LRPers probably aren't much different a demographic in terms of income to LH people. But you're not taking into account the fact that someone who does LH might focus on one or two historical periods (correct me if I'm wrong) whereas a LRPer might have a dozen different characters, only 6 of which are in play in various systems at any one time (when you count backup characters etc) - all of whom need kit, and house space to store it in.

On a personal note, I disagree with the phys rep vs authentic issue. Aluminium chain works fine, can look great - end of story. It doesn't quite look like 'proper' chain but neither does that orc in the latex mask look 'quite' like a real creature. We allow for suspension of disbelief and costume/kit acts as triggers for this. As long as there's nothing which is particularly egregious in a costume then its fine. If its better then great - all adds to the game. I see absolutely no benefit to the game in whether or not a player is wearing waterproof socks or authentic woollen things. Should someone be penalised for wearing phys rep plate vs real plate - why? If it looks good, and I am convinced they are wearing metal armour in game - what do I care if they spent £100 or £10,000 on it. (eg latex plate vs reenactor grade plate). If it looks crap then thats different.

What I don't like about living history and this is totally anecdotal and might be wrong. The size of your wallet defines what you can play/dress up as by the very nature of it and I really like that this isn't the case in LRP (coming from someone who's spent £1k on kit for one event before now) Because nothing less than absolutely authentic is acceptable for LH, you have to pay exhorbitant prices for costume - clothes, armour, weapons etc and if you can't afford that then you can't take part at the level you want. Sorry you can't play a knight but you can play a peasant...

RE living history fayres - I've often found them horrendously overpriced. I've seen hand made clothes going for £800 which were appalling in quality. I've seen ridiculously overpriced fabric and leather (and I don't mean paying a premium for authentically produced items). I've personally had experience of a costumer (Anne Laverick - don't get me started) which was shocking in terms of service. I've met nice traders there and I've met snobbish idiots. I've also seen some very nice stuff there at reasonable prices but its a mixed bag.

My point - there's dicks in all walks of live. Living History is too different to LRP to compare "gamewise" tho it might look similar on the surface. There's good and bad traders on both sides, there's good and bad costume on both. LRPers do often spend comparable sums to LH people but its spread over wider areas. LRP is also more open to people with less income/less willingness to spend that sort of money on a hobby and that is a good thing in my opinion.

And for the record I've seen LH people at exhibitions standing around in full kit chatting about football and the telly - wearing modern glasses and watches. So it ain't that far removed from the 'fest-style' complaints that always get trotted out in LRP.

Post #15408
Posted Wednesday, October 04, 2006 1:06 PM
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I have done living history stuff for a lot longer than i have done LRP and to be honest i feel that either way their are arses in all of them.  ONe of my main examples on this was a group of Knights that used to joust at one of the festivals i went to came up to my bother and started insulting him in the streets and making fun of him... he was 10 at the time and was trying to fit into working at the festival.. in short they thought they really where nobles of a day past and wanted to pick on anyone that didn't live up to their idea of what should be going on which is just being a plain out and out arse.  Though on the contrary to this i have met many amazing people that i have learned tons from and had great times with.

In Lrps i have been too i have met many great people but i do agree with the author that people take it over the top.  I have seen people go up to others and tell them they where being too rough when they scratch their precious plate or hit a little to hard.  I mean I have personally been shouted out for hitting someone to hard in the head with a peice of latex when they where wearing a metal helmet... this was coming from someone that was trying to panel beat me to the point every time i parried my sword was bending almost to breaking point.

As far as kit goes... I can't sew never have been able to and never will be able to probably... so i buy all my clothing from various people that are much better at that sort of thing than myself.  In the end larp and lh are expensive as hobbies go the cloths aren't cheap but the ones i have i like and are good quality.  The armour isn't cheap more so i think for LH than larp.  The weapons aren't cheap either once again more so for LH rather than larp.  In the end though its not what you spend on a peice of kit its how you feel wearing it... as long as you look the way you want to look for teh character your playing <in lh as well cause your just playing a character in a sense> then who cares .

In the end their are good and bad people from both types of play LH and LRP, you just have to put up with the good and bad of both.  They both have their alluring qualities and both have some qualities you might well could live without but we all enjoy them and if we didn't why would we keep going :-).

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Post #15683
Posted Wednesday, October 04, 2006 1:53 PM


Heroic Knight

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I've done both re-enactment and LRP, and stick to the LRP these days.

Personally, I feel the article does what it says on the tin. It sets out some personal opinions, apologetically and raises a talking point. Fair enough.

Some LRP has improved in quality a lot since the day... some smaller systems, casual and newer players still have cheap thrown-together kit. It's a shame the author hasn't bothered to look into the higher end immersive LRP as it's a lot closer to re-enactment standards with the addition of staying more in character like interactive theatre.

It's a particular shame that having made some intelligent observations about attitudes towards the combat, the author doesn't conclude that when on one side you have something that is competetive (LRP) and on the other you have a performance (LH) you will have very different approaches and are attempting to achieve very different things.

I had much the experience described above with re-enactment, that the people involved often had little grip on being "out of character" at any given point, so the officers were above the troops even when the public were gone and it was "time out". I found that aspect of the performance very strange and institutionalised, and it really put me off the whole atmosphere...

Still, we are all people that dress up in silly clothes and have that in common. Mind you, I bet his £13 LRP kit would get him laughed off the campsite these days...

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Post #15691
Posted Thursday, October 19, 2006 12:15 PM
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You can do a lot with 13 quid if you know what your doing.


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Post #16910
Posted Thursday, October 19, 2006 1:23 PM


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True enough --

150g Powdered kaolin, £2.97 (for spiking hair & making it go white)
30ml Kryolan TK2 Aquacolor, Turquoise £ 5.48 (as a Woad substitute)
1 pair socks, tan colour £4.50 (for modesty, covering privvy parts)

And you're away! One woad-covered, spiky-haired, skyclad Celtic warrior! Just add large axe.


http://www.hyboriantales.com

PD: Ghostdance ("The most irritating curse I've ever encountered" -- NPC played by H.)
Riftworld: Rossar Kuug ("Clearly mad, because he thinks he's a Com-Trow Skirmisher" - Aela)
Hyborian Tales: Crew, cook, dogsbody, general labourer, toilet cleaner ("Dangerously overoptimistic ref" -- Tom Nowell)
Otherwise usually crew ("Quite spry & fit, & willing to wear a big costume & run around a lot" -- various event organisers)

"My other oversized foam weapon is THE LORD" -- Questionable Content
Post #16921
Posted Thursday, October 19, 2006 2:15 PM


Wag

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It wasn't by any chance you who was the infamous 'naked pict' in the duels at one Mayfest, perchance? You know, the one who was defeated by a woman who took the sock as a trophy...

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Post #16926
Posted Friday, October 20, 2006 12:19 AM


I do talk a good fight

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Not I, no... although I believe I was the first one to do the kaolin-hair-spiking thing at Dumnonni, many years ago, when I had hair. They were all doing it a year or so later! Then everyone seemed to stop, and want to be Red Branch or Fianna or Blackshields instead.


http://www.hyboriantales.com

PD: Ghostdance ("The most irritating curse I've ever encountered" -- NPC played by H.)
Riftworld: Rossar Kuug ("Clearly mad, because he thinks he's a Com-Trow Skirmisher" - Aela)
Hyborian Tales: Crew, cook, dogsbody, general labourer, toilet cleaner ("Dangerously overoptimistic ref" -- Tom Nowell)
Otherwise usually crew ("Quite spry & fit, & willing to wear a big costume & run around a lot" -- various event organisers)

"My other oversized foam weapon is THE LORD" -- Questionable Content
Post #16973