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Wag
 
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So if it's not site costs, is it numbers? How many attend? Is it a case that if you hit say 6000 attendees then there is alot more money to spend on making it look good?
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RL: Mr Sofar
Curved core weaponry and bespoke stuff.
ShelfordFX
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Heroic Knight
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| Looking at the people behind it, one of the heads is the owner of Forgotten Dreams !! the larp weapon makers.. although dont know if he is behind the funding or ideas. Its been going 3 years, so I guess the money has been ploughed straight back in to the system rather than just spent.
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Prodigal
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A lot of smaller scale LRPs work to much higher quality than things like the Gathering. A lot of it is down to how much time people can invest (as Chris says we have less time off here than in some countries), how much money they have available, and so on. With smaller events, the lowest common denominator tends to be higher because peer pressure is easier.
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Heroic Knight
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| So what about several clubs getting together ?? maybe a few systems who focus on things like quality ?? (although I am sure all systems put huge efforts in already) A common ground system ?? I think conquest seem to alow players to bring characters from all systems as long as they integrate into the basic rules. Strength in numbers and all that ??
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Champion
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I`ve neither been to British nor German events yet, but from info available online and a few eyewitness accounts from other players I know, I get the impression there are some subtle differences. On the one hand, I think Sarah is on to something when she says smaller events often have higher standards. The Germans seem to be more 'systematic', in that they may use one system to run smaller events all over the country, with each chapter basically running its own campaign, and joining forces with other chapters for bigger events almost as an aside, but drawing from a pool of already well equipped players with established characters when they do.
At least one system is based on the setting, if not the rules, of DSA (Das Schwarze Auge), Germany`s main RPG, that has been going strong for well over twenty years now. There was even a computer game based on DSA that got released in the UK (I forget under which title). So there already was a lot of familiarity with the game before they even started.In contrast, most British systems seem to prefer targeting their own private niche markets (with some niches being bigger than others  ). On the other hand, even though German LRP can be every bit as fantastical as British, they at least look more historical. This would give them more respectability with the general public, as it is more accepted to interact with fantasy races than to portray them. (Right, elves and dragons, they had them in those days, didn`t they?) To Joe Average, you`d have to be a bit of a fairy to play one.
At the same time, this would improve the quality of the outfits, for not only have the players the benefit of historical designs that can be copied and personalised with a minimum of effort (the most fantastical outfits often being the most shoddy, the main reasons for any design to become traditional, are practicality, and ease of production!), they can easily tap into the reenactors` market for their supplies. These suppliers have jumped on the opportunity, now making their period armour in two grades: reenactment and LRP (with the main difference between a functional helmet and a look-the-part-with-less-sweating piece of armour being the thickness of steel used), and selling their period costumes, accessories and camping gear to both groups.
Sellers also seem to differ from those in the UK. Whenever someone sets up a workshop, they don`t just sell their own products to consumers. They either sell to shops, or they set up a shop (physically, as in a building you can go to), and sell stuff from other suppliers as well, importing from other countries (latex weapons and leather from Denmark, apparel from the Indian subcontinent, etc.) when they see fit. Basically, they turn into LRP/reenactment supermarkets, which makes for a wonderful availability of ready made kit. Part of the reason they can do this, is because there is less demand for highly personalised, fantastical custom items, but the main reason is the fact that LRP wasn`t originally developed in Germany. It was an established concept, that only had to be implemented, and made accessible to as many people at the same time as possible. (That`s another benefit of the more historical look: people don`t have to have read certain (series of) books or seen certain movies to get into their characters. They can base their characters upon what they learned in history class, read up a little on life in the middle ages, and go play and be surprised by whatever fantastical things the plotwriters have come up with.) While in the UK groups that have sprung up locally ultimately compete for players, in Germany groups seem to be more nationally oriented and LRP is still pretty much in a collaborative phase. There`s probably going to be some competition in the next few years, but this will only result in one system becoming dominant. Suppliers seem to have a firm hand in establishing the bigger events (designing complete basic kit for factions and selling those in bulk to players at 'event discount' - the benefit of the 'supermarket' formula) and they won`t let it get out of hand until they start competing for customers themselves. At this moment, their collective focus is on a steadily growing market.
There will be small, local clubs, if only for the wide availability of kit, and the field will most likely diversify as peopele get more and more used to the roleplaying experience.
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Heroic Knight
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| That's for sure.. I have played lots of systems and most people I know play at least 2 or 3. Maybe one day the big british clubs will consider working together..... or possibly that's a bit of a hollow dream.. As far as I was aware a great number of the systems seem to have been started by splinter groups from the old LT and others. Possibly there is just too much politics to dig through, possibly it's just a case of too many strong personalities to agree on a single point. (again without LRPstore hat on) Scarily enough, maybe the difference is that the Germans and Danish etc, look at LARP as a hobby with commercial possibilities, while the brits still seem to get offended by the notion of making money from LARP ?? it just seems stupid to me if it strengthens the hobby !! Wont ever happen I know, but imagine if all the UK lrp traders coughed up some dosh (I mean really coughed it up instead of hollw promises) towards the running etc of a 4000 player event, then the leaders of LT, CP, Mael, and Summer all got together and found a way of crossover playing to bring all worlds together... Imagine all that collective support, Kit, props, set dressing, NPC,s, refs etc.... I know I'd rather play a system like that than have to trawl overseas... If you ask me, the people at the top are great and giving a war and peace list of reasons against doing it, or why it would not work.... what I have never seen is any of them trying to come up with a list of reasons of how it could work  (I'll just nip and get me kevlar.....)
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Wag
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DarkMerchant (5/17/2008)
Wont ever happen I know, but imagine if all the UK lrp traders coughed up some dosh (I mean really coughed it up instead of hollw promises) towards the running etc of a 4000 player event, thenthe leaders of LT, CP, Mael, and Summer all got together and found a way of crossover playing to bring all worlds together...
Imagine all that collective support, Kit, props, set dressing, NPC,s, refs etc....
I think that's the LT - i.e. a mishmash of ideas without a clear paradigm/setting. If people wanted to attend that sort of game then they'd attend LT - which they do, but obviously not 4,000 people.
I'd much rather attend a game with less people, less kit, less set dressing, less NPCs, less refs but a clear set of concepts. If you've got that, then the next most important thing is people - but that's limited by the number of people who want to attend that type of game (big game organisers generally don't turn people away if they can avoid it).
I don't know about CP/Summerfest, but the attractive thing about Maelstrom is that the concepts _aren't_ being compromised to create an open system - if magical gates appeared and the LT was merged with Maelstrom I think you might well end up with less people attending that mixed event than would attend either separately.
I'm not against the idea of a big event, but not if it means compromising on all the things which make larp larp so that you can have more of the things which make reenactment reenactment that's not much of a selling position.
Marios
P.S. Short form: If you love beans on toast and you love trifle you won't necessarily love beans on toast mixed with trifle twice as much or, indeed, at all.
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Heroic Knight
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I used to be part of a group playing medics, and we used to take a full alchemy kit to events. We eventually stopped because it took over an hour to put away, and I (as the main alchemist) rarely got time to use it. We also used to take a large spare tent and several extra camp beds and set it up as a field hospital, which barely got used IC in the end. These days the hospital is unnecessary, and I reduced the Alchemy kit to a field-portable one, which still rarely gets taken to events, due to having to thin out the amount of kit because of space/transport issues.
(Dons flame-proof clothing) I think we need to just bite the bullet and just do something for ourselves for the next event we go to. Possibly some little thing in the way of a set piece or prop (Shrine, treasure box etc), or a big thing such as sorting out and set dressing an IC tent. Hopefully other players will follow our lead. I pledge that I will be taking the portable Alchemy kit to the next event I go to.
Lavlin. The overlap between re-enactors and LRPers is shrinking in the UK, and these days the traders are quite happy to sell to LRPers without too much mumbling. There are quite a lot of large Re-enactment fairs every year, and some LRP traders attend these, likewise there is an LRP specific fair (Foreign Fields) which has Re-enactment traders attending. Having attended a few Re-eactment fairs recently, when browsing traders tend to ask 'what period', and on replying 'I'm a LRPer, so whatever looks cool', I've had several admitting that they, too, are LRPers.
Re-enactment fairs are definitely worth LRPers attending if one gets an opportunity, as one can pick up some amazing objects and items. Interesting kit can be bought, as can cloth and haberdashery etc.
Ascendancy: Major Hoyght, Marine officer, Archipelago
Dr Flay, Horologist and Alchemist - www.AscendancyLRP.co.uk -
Maelstrom: '?' -All round enigma
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