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Devil's Advocate
 
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From the infamous Irish LRP'ers thread:
Tart- what about a system where plate armour is really really useful IC, but the rules say that it must be physrepped by actual metal? If I have the money to spend on a complete metal suit of armour, while no one else can OOC afford more than light leather physreps, then technically I've gotten an IC benefit as the result of being OOC rich.
Would you say that was unfair?
So that sums up the dilemna.
Is "Wallet Roleplaying" ever not a problem, or should we accept it as part and parcel of playing in a game that requires good physreps?
And if so, when does "wallet roleplay" become bad? what IC would be acceptable to buy OOC, and what would not?
If you can't beat your computer at chess, try kickboxing.
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Heroic Knight
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I don't have a problem with requiring good OOC phys reps as long as the items they represent also have an appropriate IC cost (whether it be in terms of money or other stuff like character points).
You're entitled to your opinion as long as you realise it's wrong.
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Devil's Advocate
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I agree with that, all very easy. Though you do get the problem that people could have the IC cash/points to buy something, but not the OOC cash.
Ideally of course, we would all have so much cash that everyone can afford the physreps they want and can play purely on IC terms. However, this isn't the case, so i guess it's all about where you draw the line about what is acceptable and what is "wallet roleplay".
For me, I think what is "wrong" is anything that really is only achieved through OOC cash and not through IC struggle. eg Buying platemail (that is allowed IC) is one thing, buying a super magic sword with OOC cash on ebay (that you would never be able to get otherwise IC) is quite another.
I've also just thought: By buying a physrep you are buying an OOC item. I can use it in many systems, with many different rules, so it can't be purely for a one off IC gain.
However, buying your character a magic item is (and only is) an IC gain for that character.
If you can't beat your computer at chess, try kickboxing.
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Heroic Knight
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I agree that buying in game items for OOC cash is invariably wrong. OOC cash for OOC physreps plus IC resources (cash, points, effort...) for the IC item. The two should be completely separate - there should be no way to spend OOC cash to get the IC buff, whether the cash goes to the game runners, a charity or anywhere else.
You're entitled to your opinion as long as you realise it's wrong.
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Wag
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| A lot of the time, I've found that things which can be afforded IC but not OOC can often be borrowed from someone. Often even the event organisers from crew kit. It is, after all, in the event organisers interests to make sure that everything looks good in their event so making sure the players have a standard of kit they respect is useful. My personal opinion of 'wallet roleplaying' is that it encourages better standards of kit. If certain equipment/weapons/armour have a minimum phys rep requirement then this makes the game look good overall. It doesn't have to be too stringent, either. There have been systems in the past which allowed both metal and 'fake metal' armours and judged then differently. Fake plate pieces (fibre glass, latex and foam, plastic etc), for example, gave you 4 points of armour while those willing to wear real metal got up to 6 points of armour. There are also systems where you have to have your armour judged by a ref to tell how good it is - the ref decides whether it counts as 'light leather' or 'heavy leather', for example. Often this is based on whether it is a proper heavy slab of leather covering your locations or just an old leather jacket with the sleeves cut off and a pair of leather trousers. This idea allows both sides of the argument some leeway. You can get away with 'less expensive' options and still get benefits but you get more for the more realistic armours. Of course, I don't think it is a matter of cost necessarily. You can get decent kit really cheaply if you are willing to do some work and while 'good kit' is often the more expensive options I don't think it is necessarily a linear relationship. And, of course, you can also beg, borrow or steal it if you don't want to spend the money.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- The Whispering God is your friend... trust the Whispering God... Ruins of Empire 1st - 3rd Feb, 2008, Gladstone scout centre, Chester
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Apprentice
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For me, I think what is "wrong" is anything that really is only achieved through OOC cash and not through IC struggle. eg Buying platemail (that is allowed IC) is one thing, buying a super magic sword with OOC cash on ebay (that you would never be able to get otherwise IC) is quite another.
Talk about confusing the issue.
If I go and pay OOC cash for a phys-rep of heavy armour, that is surely an example of me getting IC advantage through an expenditure of OOC cash.
Whether or not I can use it elsewhere, or whether or not I ever will use it elsewhere, is a moot point. I can afford it, and Generic Larper Who Has To Survive On Pasta (GLWHTSOP) cannot do so. I will have an extra 3 hits per loc in LT, and he won't. My greater OOC resources trump his, therefore I'm better protected IC.
The mechanism for having to buy things with IC cash doesn't avoid the above example, as no matter how rich GLWHTSOP is IC, he still cannot afford the phys-rep OOC.
LRP depends on OOC resources being spent in order to gain IC advantage. LRP events cannot take place without pieces of kit which cost OOC money being used to fulfil the requirements set by the rules. I cannot play certain races in Maelstrom unless I can afford prosthetics/makeup. I can't use heavy armour in the vast majority of systems unless me or my friends can afford to buy or make a suit of heavy armour. If me and GLWHTSOP turn up to the same event, chances are that I'll start off further ahead than him in the arms race simply because I can afford the phys-reps, and he cannot.
Wallet roleplaying is a factor in every game you go to, and there's no way around it.
So - the question from the other thread, which you said you'd answer clearly here. If you attend an event and you can't afford armour, and I attend with my suit of platemail which I spent a lot of OOC cash on so that I could gain IC benefit from wearing it, am I cheating? Am I wrong to use OOC cash to gain IC benefits?
"I like the word 'indolence'. It makes my laziness sound classy."
-Bern Williams
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Heroic Knight
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I'm with Marcus on this one - for a system where players are required to supply an OOC prop for an item that gives an IC advantage, simply balance out the OOC inequality by using a system that also requires some kind of IC expenditure (in terms of IC money, or XP, or both).
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Heroic Knight
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DaveR (9/8/2006)
[quote]Talk about confusing the issue.
If I go and pay OOC cash for a phys-rep of heavy armour, that is surely an example of me getting IC advantage through an expenditure of OOC cash.
Whether or not I can use it elsewhere, or whether or not I ever will use it elsewhere, is a moot point. I can afford it, and Generic Larper Who Has To Survive On Pasta (GLWHTSOP) cannot do so. I will have an extra 3 hits per loc in LT, and he won't. My greater OOC resources trump his, therefore I'm better protected IC.
Quite so, but because you've spent your IC resources (cash, points, whatever) on the heavy armour, GLWHTSOP's character has resources not spent on armour which can be spent on becoming harder in other ways, so your character is not better, he merely has a different skillset.
You're entitled to your opinion as long as you realise it's wrong.
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